fired pottery

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kbs2244
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fired pottery

Post by kbs2244 » Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:52 am

From today’s news page:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 75062.html

It says the figure was "fired pottery" and 6000 years old.
It a "kiln site."

When did we begin firing our pottery?
Isn't that considered a big step?
I am pretty sure it is used as a dating procedure at Western American sites.
The previous technique of baskets leaked and unfired pottery turned back into mud.

Minimalist
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Re: fired pottery

Post by Minimalist » Sun Dec 11, 2011 12:46 pm

I recall reading that Jomon Pottery from Japan dates back to the 14th millenia BC but even this was a technique imported from the mainland of Asia. Can't recall where I saw that though.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

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kbs2244
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Re: fired pottery

Post by kbs2244 » Sun Dec 11, 2011 6:56 pm

Is this going to become one of those “independently discovered” things?
Some casual research shows it showing up at different times all over the globe.

"Independently discovered" or traveling merchants/hunters/tradesmen/shamans/fishermen/ outlaws and exiles showing the locals a little trick to make life easier?

Glaze seems to be another, wholly different, thing.

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Digit
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Re: fired pottery

Post by Digit » Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:16 pm

Once you had fire 'firing' of clay would logically follow.
Any small timber pulled from clayey ground then burned would give a hint of the possibilities.

Roy.
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Re: fired pottery

Post by JGF » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:13 pm


JGF
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Re: fired pottery

Post by JGF » Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:19 pm


kbs2244
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Re: fired pottery

Post by kbs2244 » Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:28 pm

So there can be as much as 10,000 years from one area to another?
And Europe seems to be at the end of the spread?

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Re: fired pottery

Post by JGF » Mon Dec 19, 2011 4:18 pm

I posted both articles because they are quite different. Fired clay appears to have been used to create symbolic objects, such as figurines, long before it was used to create utilitarian objects such as pots or bowls. That doesn't necessarily mean people weren't using other materials for storing or carrying water, for instance. It is hypothesized that extensive and elaborate use of bamboo for storing and/or channeling water may predate pottery, so might skin bags -- these would not preserve in the archeological record the way pottery would.

E.P. Grondine

Re: fired pottery

Post by E.P. Grondine » Mon Dec 19, 2011 5:21 pm

Perhaps unless you're in a sedentary society, pottery may not have advantages over other technologies for storage and cooking.

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Re: fired pottery

Post by Minimalist » Mon Dec 19, 2011 5:59 pm

Pottery is heavier and far more fragile than, say, an animal skin for carrying water, or a reed basket for food.

One would have to question the utility of pottery for an H/G group.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

-- George Carlin

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Re: fired pottery

Post by JGF » Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:06 pm

Exactly the prevailing wisdom -- HG's aren't supposed to use pottery b/c it's heavy & fragile. But it keeps turning up pre-agriculture in China with really early dates. Weird.

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Digit
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Re: fired pottery

Post by Digit » Wed Dec 21, 2011 5:41 pm

Which is based on the assumption that H/G groups were always on the move, but is that so?
With a low population and a rich enough area, would they keep moving?
I doubt it.

Roy.
First people deny a thing, then they belittle it, then they say it was known all along! Von Humboldt

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Re: fired pottery

Post by dannan14 » Wed Dec 21, 2011 7:55 pm

Digit wrote:Which is based on the assumption that H/G groups were always on the move, but is that so?
With a low population and a rich enough area, would they keep moving?
I doubt it.

Roy.
They may have taken many hunting or trading trips though the year...especially in Summer, but even without agriculture it makes a lot of sense to have a permanent settlement whereever you find a nice cliff overhang or cave. It never sat well with me that H/G is often used synonymously with nomad.

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Re: fired pottery

Post by Minimalist » Wed Dec 21, 2011 9:09 pm

My guess is they would follow the animals. If animals migrated the humans would have migrated after them.
Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed.

-- George Carlin

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Re: fired pottery

Post by dannan14 » Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:04 am

Minimalist wrote:My guess is they would follow the animals. If animals migrated the humans would have migrated after them.
Or they would have learned the migration routes within several days travel from their home as well as what times of year they should send out scouts to look for the herds. That would allow them to plan large, efficient hunts since they would have somewhere to store dried meat, skins, furs, usable bones, sinew, stomachs, bladders, etc.

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