Peopling of Americas

[Roxanne]

Here is a cite to a new paper which argues that the America's were peopled after a glacier melt in several successive waves. Ineresting DNA studies and good pre and post glacial maps.


http://www.plos.org/press/pone-03-02-mulligan.pdf

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/ ... 021108.php

[Beagle]

Thank you, Roxanne. This will take a little while to study. It looks good.

[Minimalist]

But while they were hanging out in Beringia until 15,000 years ago, who was living at James Adovasio's Meadowcroft site 16,000 years ago?

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsbu ... 29297.html

In the 1930s, artifacts dating back 11,000 years were found near Clovis, New Mexico. The discovery led scientists to declare that the Clovis people were the first to populate North America.

That theory held strong until Meadowcroft. When radiocarbon dating tests came back in 1974 showing Meadowcroft artifacts dated back 16,000 years, a fierce debate began.

[Rokcet Scientist]

Here is a cite to a new paper which argues that the America's were peopled after a glacier melt in several successive waves. Ineresting DNA studies and good pre and post glacial maps.

http://www.plos.org/press/pone-03-02-mu ... 021108.php

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/ ... 021108.php

Hi Roxanne,

That first link gets me a "404 - page not found" notice.
The second link does not contain any images, of pre and post glacial maps, that I can see....
Something seems to have gone awry.

[Beagle]

http://www.plos.org/press/pone-03-02-mulligan.pdf

Here is the link that she posted in the News thread, RS.

[Minimalist]

I fixed Roxanne's original link.

Ah....POWER!!!!!

[john]

Now, gang, the Windover site in Florida.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/bog/america.html

Datable material plus dee-en-ay.

Gosh darn it;

They apparently aren't Amerinds.

And the instantaneous development of fine textiles by Beringian Siberian refugees who made a beeline to the kindly coast of Florida kind of leaves my mind reeling.......

On the other hand, maybe Florida was the retirement mecca for the Beringians. After all that snow and ice 4,000 miles to the North and West.

If so, the pull must have been strong for retirees with non-Asian haplotypes to trek thru Siberia and then across North America to get there.

I can hear the song now........."Faster dogs, younger women, older whiskey".

I can also sell you a bridge. I have a fine inventory.



john

They must have been mighty stout, and long lived.



p.s. As to the textiles - at a minimum those people had the cognitive ability to turn the concept of warp and weft, and twisted fibre into tools and cloth.

Here's the list:

Spot on knowledge of local plants and the techne to convert them into spinning fibre.

Drop-spindles for spinning fine gauge yarn.

Backstrap or frame loom, mounted with the warp, with handheld shuttles for the weft and a handheld sword, or beater bar, to pound the weft even.

They did not twine this cloth.

So where are we at?

6-10 k years ago in North America?

Comparable finds worldwide?

Enquiring minds want to know.

j

[Cognito]

Interesting article in PLOS. However, it could support more than one conclusion. I read the chart on page 2 differently but with interest. As opposed to the period of 35Kbp to 15Kbp being named "Occupation of Beringia" renaming the chart as "Paleo Occupation of America" would explain all those paleo tools we find in the Western US that pre-date Clovis.

I find it difficult to believe that people would rush from Central Asia to Beringia 35Kbp and then just stop there for 20K years. What -- they didn't know about boats? And can you imagine the climate in Beringia at the height of the LGM? They're freezing their butts off in total darkness half the year! Northern Eurasia was depopulated from 24Kbp to 18Kbp but Beringia was different?:roll:

[Minimalist]

I find it difficult to believe that people would rush from Central Asia to Beringia 35Kbp and then just stop there for 20K years.

I can think of nicer places to hang out than the edge of a glacier. How did that work? Did the leaders say:

"Hang on, boys.....it's melting. Any day now we can get through to Alaska."

Sorry. Hunters following the pack ice and killing sea mammals as they went along in their boats makes a hell of a lot more sense. And you could easily move 1-5000 people, in successive waves, in that manner.

But then, of course, you don't have to wait for the ice to melt, do you?

[Beagle]

I took a good look at this study yesterday evening. For Clovis Firsters, this is really a Dream Theory.

It answers the DNA questions about the Amerinds, showing that their last contact with Siberians was 30,000 yrs. ago.

It solves the question of why no Clovis points have been found in Siberia. They were developed in Beringia.

All of the proof/ disproof is buried under water.

IMO, this theory is BS. But I bet it's not going to go away.

[Cognito]

All of the proof/ disproof is buried under water.

Reminds me of Atlantis -- the Clovis firsters are getting desperate.

[Digit]

They are like dinosaurs Cog, soon they'll be extinct!

[Minimalist]

Oh. I thought you meant they'd be vegetarians on an ark.

[john]

All -

Just to add fuel to the fire, here.........

Contemporaneous with, or earlier than the Club-sanctioned

Beringian Outbreak, or

The March of the Clovis (boy howdy, what a ring to that phrase!),

We have

A sophisticated culture in Florida

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/bog/america.html

A sophisticated culture in Chile

http://www.unl.edu/rhames/monte_verde/MonteVerde.htm

http://www.cabrillo.edu/~crsmith/mverde.html

Another culture in Pennsylvania

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meadowcroft_Rockshelter

And, of course, Kennewick man

Clear up on the Columbia River in the Northwest, who,

By golly

Was not Amerind.

Matter of fact, none of them were Amerind, because

Those Beringian Pioneers of the Archaic Revolution were still figuring

Their footsore path through Alaska/Canada.

Florida.

Chile.

Pennsylvania.

Washington.

Think about it.

Boats, hematite?

john

[kbs2244]

Arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic